Ep. 33 Native Education Experience

0:00 For full disclosure. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the guests in the host. The content here is for informational purposes only. Thank you everyone for tuning in. My name is Napoleon. I'm part of the donal Outhom Young Voices podcast. I'm talking about autumnal Atom and Peeposh and recently graduate student from Arizona State University, and I want to just introduce a few of our guests here that we have tonight, but also one of our my colleagues here, Bree like introducer as well. So yeah, thank you all so much for joining us, and happy Autumn New Year if you're listening and you're autumn as summer Solstice is here, So thank you all for joining us, and we are really excited about our topic we have. I agree if you want to go ahead and introduce yourself and then you can introduce our guests. Yeah, hell yeah. My name is Brian Harvey and I'm don Insition Cootney. I'm also a recent grad from the OBA with my bachelor's in public health and a Trouble Law certificate, and I'm also the content creator for this podcast. Thank you, Gree and We'll go ahead and turn over to our guest. Um. We have Monique and Crystal here with us, and

1:30 we can go ahead and get started about introducing yourself, any cool things that you're up to or anything like that, and then we can go ahead and get into our conversation. He not Crystal Miller, and Nania not Guya Kada Na Lane Hicks Nabia and a Montoya Na Nai Na Na Tashi Nania. Hello everyone. My name is Crystal Miller. I'm an enrolled citizen of the walk Over put You tribe located in what is now known Northern Nevada. I am currently a HD student at the University of Arizona UM in the American Nadian Studies Department, and my research focus is in Indian Reorganization Act reform. I'm a mother to three children, an eleven year old, two year old, and a one year old, and i also work for the Native Nations Institute for Everyone Ya Monique Carvey and Chia has Gonzo Nichelkachi Baschin Tabaha that Sha chain tenni Zenie. Good evening to all. My name is Monique Carvey Ika showing on the Fruit Plan Growing Foot the Red House People Plan. My Chain. Maternal grandfather is a water Edge people plan and Manelli paternal grandfather is a Tango clan.

2:39 I'm originally filmed Tis West, Arizona, and I am alum of the University of Arizona a class of twenty thirteen. I graduated from you Oba with a Bachelors of Science of Public Health and a minor in psychology. Currently right now a graduate student at the University of Colorado, Denver, and currently pursuing a Masters of Air in school counseling and free time when I have it, I enjoy traveling, rock climbing, apparently right now not in the best shaprit, but hope to be soon better at it. So I'll go with you. Awesome. Yeah, a lot of two song represented right now. You know you let me just throw out I just cried, so yeah, so I just yeah. Recently graduated from a su with the Masters in American Indian Studies with the emphasis on Indigenous rights and social justice. However, I'm still working on my master's drinking in Public administration. And so how we sort of developed this episode. If you all have been following us, we've been covering different topics about the summer socistice is autom buy Dutch the harvesting, and so we wanted to sort of navigate a conversation around different experiences in education since we are fairly new, you know, to the graduate space. You know, now we have to start thinking about careers, life choice has grown up decisions, you know, and so we're out there and we wanted to bring into influential folks who are working in tremendous places of student advocacy and a lot of

4:14 times that we don't get to hear about some of these experiences that we've had being in different positions, and so we wanted to engage the community as you all have our questions in a Google form, so we were really happy to also get that as sort of a leeway into the conversation as far as Indigenous experiences in higher ed. But also not just that, but even if we were doing a ged if you're in middle school or high school. So we wanted to get a range of responses, and the responses we've gotten have been really really great and critical and how we're going to engage our conversation tonight. So thank you all for those of you who did fill out this Google documentation because it really helps us really navigate the conversation about what our experiences are, especially during this time coming from a pandemic and where we're all sort of coming together on the first thing you can talk about, Monique or Crystal, which everyone used to chime in, is sort of like preparing you know, your journeys. How did you prepare into feeling like you're you're welcomed or like going into these different places and higher education? Okay, So for me, I am a first generation college student, so navigating high education was extremely hard.

5:30 I didn't have anybody in my family that I could turn to, so I've just kind of been navigating it blindly. One thing that has been very beneficial for me, especially in my educational journey, is having and finding mentors. So most of my mentors have strategically been indigenous academics and educators and faculty and staff because they can relate to some of the barriers that I've had encountered with higher education, but as well as some of the navigating the success and then how to sustain that, because sometimes we reach a high and then we don't know how to stay there because we don't have support systems that can relate to some of our experiences as Native and Indigenous students in higher education, and so for me, I didn't have a preparation plan kind of did it. But in order for me to navigate and be in the position that I am, I had to find mentors and friends with the same mission and same goals.

6:30 And a lot of times, a lot of the friends, like you guys, can all relate, have goals to better our own communities or surrounding native communities, or if we're occupying other Native lands, we're going to benefit their communities for the time being, and so just sharing the same vision is really helpful. I agree one percent with Crystal. I would say I got a lot close with my adviser and my first year undergrad, her name is Josie. She introduced me to a lot of range of people, starting first with like a talking medicine circle, which was something that was very new to me going into a college environment and not knowing a lot of people. So talking in a circle with others was very enlightening knowing that I wasn't the only one who was a little bit of homesick, was doing college my own and didn't really have much family in the area at the time, so it's basically kind of like growing my own independence. So I'm really grateful that I learned a lot from just attending some events out of my comfort zone and started to gain my own self esteem and confidence. So I think that was really something that was very enlightening to me during my experience, and I hope that others will get that chance. Even though amazing, daunting, or a little bit scary at times, but you never know what you're going to run into. Maybe you'll find your long term roommate at this event, or even a lifelong friendship develops, or even a future opportunity even comes to light. So I say that's something i'd like to share. Thank you for sharing, um Napoleon.

8:01 I think something that I noticed a lot when we read the answers to the Form and Relationship being prepared. I think a lot of it was community and cultural identity and just finding others to make you feel comforted and supported. I think it's really crucial and important, especially for us as Native kids, and like you guys said, finding mentors, people to lead you, people to guide you, it is really important. I also definitely heavily agree that that helped me get through school as well. Just having somebody to talk to but also somebody to rely on and push you. It's definitely more helpful than you think it is. Yeah, definitely. And we did have a response that was like fifty percent prepared, and it was like, well, what does what does that look like? Well, how do you fifty percent like measuring on a scale like I'm fifty percent know that I'm going to graduate, you know, or something of that sort of nature, because I how we sort of view preparedness is always different where we're missing on a scale or like yeah, I'm you know, I've been through all these programs, so now I feel confident in talking to navigating a college spaces or it's like, well, you know, I usually talk to my grandma for advice. That prepares me.

9:18 You know, I know my community that prepares me. So it is a really interesting response. And then you know, the culture identity was a big one that we had a lot of response from, because you know, you're preparing and there's like different layers of preparedness when you're an indigenous student, first year, come from a family with PhDs educators. So we yeah, that was a really interesting question and thank you for your responses and so um with that preparing and now like you're in the space. Now you're working for different communities, you're working you know, advocating. So there is there any unique experiences that you've had, whether it's in the field that you're working in or like as a student, any unique experiences that you any of you sort of had during the time when you're a uvay or you know, bachelor's degree or even like were your work spaces. I would say for me as an undergrad at you obey, they would host through an organization called America India Alumni, and it was during my first year that I learned a lot of what the AIA supports to you obey and not only helped to educate others about our culture. To you obey, like there's more than one reservation in the area and how to recognize it and give recognition to it. I think that was something that was kind of new to me as opposed to the student coming from reservation and grew up on a reservation their entire life, so you would think

10:52 that maybe others would kind of in a sense of that as well, but coming to a different environment where not many people know the back ground or the history of a tribe. I think that was really something that inspired me more further into pursuing going further in education, like making our presence known as well and then honoring in different ways. So I think for me, that was honoring experience from me at you of a and it's growing now here in my current graduate journey. But that's something I would definitely say to students, like make your presence known and don't be great to educate others too as well during your college journey, so drop some knowledge. I totally agree. Sorry I didn't know. Are you done? Yeah? Sorry, but no, I totally agree. I think one of the highlighted experiences that I've had in higher education because like if you think about my statistical journey, like from a child, so now I'm not supposed to be in high education and I'm not supposed to be almost a doctor. I should probably be like in jail or somewhere, you know, Like I just but that was never my path. But ever since I was a young girl, I've always been doing activists works, specifically for my community and then the indigenous community that I grew up in because I grew up on two different reservations and one being mine and one not being mine. So I was always involved in those kind of things. One thing that was interesting for me is when I got to ASU, I'm at a professor named doctor James writing in and he kind of showed me the way of you can still continue to be the activist that you've always been, now you're

12:26 just an academic activist. And so it kind of has fueled a lot of the research and academic success that I've had because of that understanding that you can maintain both. You don't have to give up being an activist and you don't have to give up fighting for your nations just because you're in the academy, which most times academy it's not serving to our nations, but you know, we're in there disrupting those types of things. To that way, the generation after us has the door opened a little bit more, and then generation after them it's going to be open more. And so those kind of ideas us and concepts and things that we're bringing in takademia now are being normalized generationally. As long as we keep that knowledge with us. That's a good point.

13:09 And you know, wouldn't re share when you were going to school the comment that was sort of made because, like you said, like there's just so many things that are always we're constantly educating people about. And so when we're talking about this prepping and mentioned something that is a unique experience that I'm sure we've all come across and if you had any thoughts on that, every if you want to share, if you yeah, I can definitely share. So I think my experience just moving into a different area and then being maybe one of three indigenous students at my school. I went to high school Sawarita, which is like twenty twenty five minutes south from Tucson. I moved there like a week before high school. I had only ever lived in Kurtland and Farmington and Teas as well my entire life, and I felt very sheltered. I didn't know what to expect, and I guess my very first experience kind of explains my entire high school experience. But so it was my very first class of the day and haven't talked to anybody nothing. I was just everything was new. I was very scared. I was very shy at the time.

14:18 Tale and I walked into my first class and it's filled with older students like seniors and juniors and I sit down sit down next to these two older guys, and I started telling them about myself where I'm from, and the first thing they asked me was, so, do you have a TP in your backyard? And I was so shocked. I was appalled. I was like, did he really just say that to me? And I did no idea what to say, Like, I'm pretty sure I just laughed it off at the time, but I was talking appalling yesterday about how like it's funny, we're just laughing about it, because it's really crazy to think about. But if you really think about it, like these are very weird things for us to experience and have to deal with, and especially you know, just being a kid and having to stick up for your own people. I also had an experience with a history teacher who said that Native of Americans weren't impressed.

15:07 And there was just like little things like that that happened a lot through my high school, and I think it really pushed me to be the first I am today to want to speak up to show the world who we are, who we can be. You should have told that guy that you got weeds around your TV he can pull. Yeah, those are those are differently um interesting experiences because what we're talking mentioning earlier with Bree is, you know, I don't think any other community by Park, you know, any other communities kind of laugh about it. You know, we're always like, yeah, that was crazy. You know, I got this asked question if you know, if I was Navaho or not. You know, like just walking down the street and they're like, hey, are you Native? And you know you don't. You know, these constant things that we were just like walking around or just sit down and then all of a sudd and say like it's a foreign country, you know, like from Farmington, New Mexico, grew up on a never you know, I'm from Hilo River and Alcamon at them and they're like whoa who's that? You know, like whoa? UM.

16:11 I think a lot of times experiences happen outside of the university for me, you know, going in Uber, just going to I worked at the herd for like my summer I saw I'd always get questions like what's the herd. Oh, it's just native you know Native arts and things are like oh, you're Native, and then you know it's just it's always I'm just like, ah, so it's exhausting sometimes and those unique experiences always like travel with us wherever we go, and I'm sure like no matter how many degrees or things like that, we try to you know, put to prove ourselves or always like sort of like very humble about it, you know, oh what a doctor, you know, and then then you bet then you get these like very mediocre questions like so what nation are you from. They don't ever want to talk about your research, they don't want to talk about your advocacy.

16:56 They're just like, you know, I've been to yeah, you know, I Farmington. You know, I've been to you know, within the Rock. You know. It's like, you know, talk about my dissertation or something. You know, that's always an interesting thing of unique experiences. And if you're out there listening and you're in high school, you know, don't feel afraid to educate those out there. If you're listening, you know, don't feel ashamed of where you come from. It's it's a great thing that people just don't know. But when they do know, they're like it'll stick with them somewhere. Yeah, So, was there was there any experiences like sort of like that, Crystal, I know, you mentioned like in the beginning, like some people don't know where that's at, you know, don't know when Nevada, where that's at. Yeah, it's that you ask, because every time people think people that don't know, when they think about natives, they think about one, how Navajos look, how the big guy on Pocahanas or peter Pan and so like all the time they're like, you don't like native, But if I show you like twenty different paytes from my territory, you'd be like, why are you guys all look just like? So it's so funny. People always categorized as especially being down here. So maybe that's like my true experience being down here in Arizona. So I've like formally been down here in like three years, but like if you count the times I've actually been here, it's only been like a year. So that's my experience here. But we have this old saying and it kind of speaks to what you were talking about, Napoleon, And we call these guys sad guys and bad guys, and it's something that's kind of always stuck with me.

18:27 And so sad guys are the ones who don't know any better, and so those are the ones that you really have to educate, and like you said, most likely it's going to stick with the sad guys. But then you also have the bad guys who do know better and they don't care and you're never gonna want to fight with them. You're just talking into a wall. You have to like acknowledge those kind of things. Is it a sad guy that I can help, that I can educate, he's gonna stick with he's gonna ally for us, or is he a bad guy? Because if he's a bad guy, you just go do something else for sure. Thank you for sharing that. Yeah, a lot of our responses. I want to also acknowledge that there was some that feel like it was just moments like where I was feeling unsafe and insecure about who I was, you know, to kind of acknowledge that as well, because I know we've all felt that even though I was going somewhere that was just in my backyard, there was no one at all like me, not even just a single other native that I can just relate to because it was you know, it's one of the largest universities in the country, and you're just like, what's going on and to acknowledge that you know that those experiences are really real, you know, feeling unsafe, whether that's being insecure. You know, you're in this program, you don't know if you can get the amount of grade. So you have all these things on your shoulders, scholarships, things that you have to maintain, a family, you know, family community, and so you're coming in with a lot of stuff, and so I just want to acknowledge that responds to because you know, those are really things that experiences that for those that aren't able to talk about it, we just recognize that those are real and

19:57 those do happen in our when we do enter these spaces. So, but what means you know that that's or we're in the education space to help alleviate and acknowledge those and push towards a bright or more confident level of where we stand as native people. So to get where the position that you've all have been, you know, whether that's the support what exactly? Well, I guess because you all work in different types of advocacy, and I think that's what it's really intriguing, is like when we're talking about getting students involved or getting advocacy efforts involved with policy or health or any type of ways in indigenous communities, because everydigitous community is different. So what resources do you did you really utilize now that you wish you had back then, whether that could be learning about you know, tribal water rights or anything that you know. Monique, you said you're part of ACES, which a lot of students are part of the STAMP programs left and right. You know, you can't go anywhere without a STEM major. So this is revolving around like what resources that you've had that you wish you had before them that really helped shine your the work that you're doing now. I would say for me, something that really helped me back then would be like a mentorship program. There was a mentorship led by doctor durn Biggae and it was for first gen students, no matter if it's undergrad or graduate or even a KH student. I gave a lot of

21:30 support and awareness to not only Native American students, but others as well, and it really gave them the opportunity to discuss not only like academic issues, but personal issues as well. So I think that space has widened a lot, especially in my work. Now with ACES, we are able to support students not only through financial support, but also mentally as well as featuring them and opportunities that can definitely expand them later on down the road. One of them is like an internship experience that gives send a chance to journey out outside of the reservation and then again dropping knowledge about where they're from and where they hope to take what they gained from the internship back home and hopefully expand into that stem field. And so that's something I very much was able to grow and prosper in through the mental opportunity with Actor. During BIGE, I was able to grow confidence and sharing a lot of advocacy and support resources from you of AY as well as from NASA the Native American Student Affairs Office, and was able to tell them like, there's so many resources here that are wanting to help you, and the first step is just going out there and taking part of it or taking a chance on it, to making sure that what you're going to utilize and gain from this is going to help you way much more down the road. It's like it's kind of like a full circle experience because once you gain that experience, someone like you, a younger you, is going to come back and be like, hey, how did you get your start? How did you get through the program? How did you get through a course? How'd you survive you one day of school? So I always try to tell them that, like, hey, if you look back

23:00 at a younger you, it's going to come back and say like what did you do? So be a resource not only to yourself but to others as well. It's something I definitely like advocate to students all the time, making sure we all went to our own challenges and barriers, but remembering that not only are you serving yourself, but you're serving your community in your own special way. So one thing that you have a just recently implemented, I believe in the fall. So this will be the first year that it Ran is an Indigenous counselor and I haven't had the opportunity to go see them. I've just been super busy. I'm a mom of three and PhD I were two jobs, so I should spend in allocate more time to go see them.

23:42 But why I say that is it really important is because I know the struggle it is as an Indigenous student who doesn't have that support. When I was at ASU, I didn't have insurance it's like mid pandemic. I just had two newborn babies right back to back, and I had struggled with postpartum for almost two years because they were back to back and I had no support most of the time I was in Arizona. When I was in Arizona, I was by myself with just the kids, and I tried to go to counseling with the free counselors that ASU offered, and it didn't work out. They were non Indigenous, and they don't have to be, but they had absolutely no idea about Indigenous experiences. They don't know. The guy that I had, I guess he was just randomly given to me, didn't know anything about historical generational trauma, didn't understand anything about childhood trauma, and so it was really detrimental to me. It almost to the point where I felt like I was walking backwards, like to the and it was so crazy. I had to even explain what imposter syndrome was, because I struggled with the imposter syndrome the entire time, and even here and there, I struggled with it just because it's hard being Indigenous and higher education, especially the longer you stay, it just gets harder and harder. So if I would have had a resource like that when I was at a SU, I think that my experience would have been a lot better because I struggled the entire time that I was there,

25:15 and so I'm really happy and I was happy to learn about it when you know, in the beginning of every semester they have like all of those boots out on the lawns and stuff. That's why I learned about it. So I was like, man, all these little Native students out here, they got a good but don't forget to use them. They're there for a reason. The university did a lot of work to find what kind of needs that people like us need and what kind of support that they can give, and their institutionalizing it, they're putting the people in those types of positions who are qualified to help us. So I know, traditionally and historically it's like super taboo for Indigenous people to go even seek help and counseling and talk about our feelings, but it really is beneficial, especially when you're struggling the way that I was struggling. Thank you for sharing that because it brings a good point of just the resources that we have in different academic spaces. I was talking to about, we have this, but then we don't have this.

26:10 So what you're mentioning is like those mental programs for aces. You know, those internships which which STEM is a very competitive field engineers everything systeming from all that electrical mechanical, those are very competitive, and we were mentioned I've heard horror stories about students going into just like these very depressive states because those are very competitive programs. That's when, like Crystals mentioning these these obstacles of going into you know, you're feeling depressed. It's just challenging, you know, even having to do that and then go back home and your focus so much on this like competitiveness. I got to get an A in this class. You know, you're you're draining yourself out, and so those it's like, you know, for years, I think ASU has been trying to talk about getting you know, indigenous counselors, and you've been pushing for that a lot of people have been pushing that initiatives. So and then now you're very implementing that is really good for those resources and there because I know the Crystals mentioned, those life changing moments happen families. You know, you'd never know that every major is different. You know, it's just that stress of trying to keep up and things of that nature. So and I know, like you're mentioning a lot of like your mentors have been been very advocates, so advocates for you. It's not all just like all by yourself. So just letting listeners know that it's not about you know, you do, in some way do able to have a community around you, whether that's your native community,

27:40 whether that's within academic spaces, that that community is there to support you. And if you are in sort of like you know, feeling this dream what is it called burnout? You know, and you're feeling this sort of way of feeling like I don't know, this is imposter streams M I know it. And recognizing those earthly triggers of how you feel about the way you're approaching different things because it could range. So it's good that you all mentioned that those types of things because it all entangles one another, Like you're saying this trick did people just don't know like what inter generational trauma and all those messy the messy stuff and that's within itself was struggle to just like talk about because as you were vamping it all up again and like you don't understand. So yeah, I don't know, Breed. Do you want to add anything as far as like mentors and things like what got you sort of through your final steps of your program. Yeah. So I definitely had a rocky road through a school. Um. I definitely didn't realize the resources I did have, which I know a lot of people understand and feel too. I did find some great resources near the end of school, which I am grateful that I found. I do wish I found them earlier though, But I think the biggest thing for me was not only finding my own community in little spaces that I could at school through clubs. The only Native club I was really a

29:12 part of was NALSA, the Native Law Club Pierre at the job and just seeing how many other Indigenous kids who are putting themselves in these what I saw before as impossible to get into spaces you know, has been so it was really powerful and empowering for me, and it gave me the motivation I needed, and also the support just talking to them and also the people they had come and speak to that club to follow my dreams and do whatever it is I need to do to you know, accomplish my passions in life and help my own people, my community. And so I think the biggest thing I've learned was how much I could learn from other people, even if it's not Indigenous students in particular, just other students in general. I think we all have a you know, we're all very different journeys, but we still have a lot to teach each other. So I really just try to cherish that throughout, you know, school. So I think, you know, don't be afraid to take up spaces that we aren't normally in, because in that way, I've been blessed with so many different opportunities to be the face, be someone to stand up so then others can fall behind me. But yeah, that's all I have. They say that with the pull up chairs a tables, we weren't invited to exactly exactly drag that chair over. Yeah, exactly. Because my friend Robbie, if you're listening out there, this is always stuck out to me, he said, if you're not at the table, you're on the menu. So I always think of that all the time, Like Dana's so true. It's like, well, that's not our problem, you know, but it's going to be because it all entails. It's

30:45 going to eventually come back to you're looking at it. It's just you're not being served right now. You know. One thing I wanted to ask both of you, because I know another resource where we were talking about, and this is outside of academia that we know as indigenous people, is you know, feeling grounded, So family, elders, traditional practices, what does that look like to feel grounded? Where you're where you are at? Um? You know, Monique, you're in your way. Um, Crystal, you've been traveling a lot. You know, you travel constantly, Like what does that grounding take place? And how does that is? What does that look like? As far as you know, this ever constant journey of traveling and family and then trying to keep up a grade. So how do you see grounded? I guess you would say. I think for me, and I don't encourage this because it is highly not feasible, okay, but for me, I always go home. Yeah, if I don't feel good, I will like if I'm like broke, I'll find a way to make the gas.

31:52 I'm going home. But that's that's just who I've always been, and that's that's what helps me. And if I ever couldn't, then I always go hillside when I need to clear my mind or like I'm not feeling good. Me and another good friend of mine, actually two good friends of mine. One just graduate with her PhD and she's not a hole in Blackfeet, and then another good friend of mine is from White Mountain and we all share similar struggles and it's not one hundred percent of the time we can make it home. So we'll just send a little text and say, hey, you want to go hillside and we'll just go hike, like for hours. So that helps me a lot. I know it's not my land, but it's a connection to land. Yeah, I agree with Crystal. I'm kind of similar. Whenever things get a little closed in, a little tight too stress a little bit more, I definitely go outside. Luckily there's a mountain, and I love this mountain because I realized my problems aren't as big as I think they are. It's really small and compared to a big world. So that's something I always keep in mind in my perspective and background. But one thing for sure is but I miss home. I miss my family, my loved ones. I make food specifically fibread or fan potatoes because that keeps me filled and it gets back a sense of purpose of like why I moved a

33:22 little bit farther away from family from home. It brings back that sense of purpose for me, and it just brings back the whole feeling of like family and loved again. So it's not their hugs, it's their food. And I'm feeling in my belly so great. Do you have anything? Yeah? Okay, well if you couldn't tell or new Me and Monique our cousins, I don't know if we've forgot to say that, but so yeah, she's my family obviously, and I definitely feel the same way. I just if I could drive, if I had the sleep capacity to drive home all the time, I would, but it's seven hours away and my back can't do that. But but when I am feeling just you know, lass and I need some you know, to respark that light again. I love calling my ya yaha, my nully, you know, just to hear they're soft voices, and to hear how their days when and just remembering, like every single day when I'm here studying, reading for hours and hours their home. They're waiting for me. They're always going to be there and this is for them, you know, so that definitely helps. It's easier to go home, but it helps. Yeah, thank you for sharing, because those those are always the things that we get response. When we got the response on you know, Grounded, you know, there was mentors, there was you know, being at a Ivy League school, you know, being in that sort

34:53 of realm, that's totally different thing. You know, resources you have, so they have to seek out res sources in an Ivy League school, you know, even a small margin possibly in a university like that. And then there was one that stuck out was like Grounded, Grounded, you know, family, elders, traditions, practices, and I think that's where we all always ask each other, like, ah, do you have any you know, sage or sweet grass around here making you feel that or smell that sense of belonging again. And for me, you know, it's just family. You know, I have eleven year old, so I always you know, talk to him just to get away from all the things and get different perspectives. And kids are also a beaming light of knowledge as well, because they're so they haven't experienced a lot of the things that we've experienced, you know, so when you're opening up their mind to different things, they're asking questions.

35:43 You know, they're like two or three sentences and you could be like, oh, yeah, it's actually better than what I thought about. We're not thinking about it's so critical. You know. I think our families and our kids and children really have that sort of since of bringing you back to where it is, like that light again. And then like you're mentioned, like food, you know, things that really motivate us to feel in a way of feeling good. So yeah, thank you for Shanna, because those are just always different, different perspectives and things that I'll connect to us throughout relationships and stuff. So and I guess the next the next sort of topic we wanted to mention because this was a really really big one that a lot of our listeners responded to, and it was so sort of talking about different experiences, but also we can't go about experiences without talking about challenges and barriers, and we sort of mentioned a little bit of them, you know, challenges and barriers that have whe they've been in academy or outside, you know, having raising family, staying on top of your grades, So what else other challenges that you faced while attending or doing the work that you're doing right now. That kind of sort of key focus, you know, because when one of the things that I always look back on are just like financial aid, being able to support yourself, but also like your family, Like those are the things like, okay, I have to stay focused. Those are

37:14 the biggest challenges. And I know a lot of students face those native students, whether it's financial aid and scholarships, not knowing how to deal with manage money, you know, and things of that nature. I know a lot of students always I don't want to take out a loan, you know, there's a lot of always working in a field of advocacy for students, it's always that first thing is his finances, Like how don't pay for school? I don't get my books. So straight away from that a little bit, but there was also mentions of like homesickness, which we've sort of discussed career growth, what you're majoring in, sort of that imposter syndrome. It might worthy enough to be in STEM, you know, sort of those highly competitive academic journeys. There was challenges would professors like Bree was mentioning, you know, history teacher. So a lot of our responses have really sort of been all kinds of different ways, have been different challenges that they faced, So off you would like to share sort of what a huge challenge that was sort of happening, but then how you sort of over those those particular challenges.

38:21 I have a lot of challenges, so I'll go through just a couple. One major challenge that I've always had is I've never had the ability to have financial support from my family to go to higher education, and so it wasn't it was never an option to just go to school, like I've always had to work to support myself and my children while going to school. And so that in itself has been a challenge because there's many times where it's like, Okay, well let me just choose one, and it's obviously not going to be the education one, because I can't live and I have a bunch of kids and how are they going to eat? And so those responsibilities are already a part of my life every day, and so that's been a real challenge.

39:13 It's also been a challenge dealing with how the system in Arizona is set up, and so they have childcare priced more than what for the three kids that I have. There is a very small bracket of people who can pay that. And because I wasn't an Arizona resident when I first started, I barely became a resident given though I want to, as I was always considered out of state. So I had to establish residency in order to get any kind of subsidy for childcare. And it's not like I've had like this conversation with people who are like, oh, wow, you know, the poor Natives just always need subsidy. But it's like, well, yeah, when you're charging thirty five dollars a month for childcare, everybody's gonna need subsidy.

40:05 And so that's another barrier that I encountered. And I've always had professors, mostly early on, who have challenged my perspective because my worldview and life goals don't conform to Western education. Like most of the time I'm arguing with my professors, and that's okay because I'm pretty good at arguing. So that's always been a very large challenge. And yeah, those are probably two of the largest ones. Like, like, I have challenges all the time, but we all do you know, and you just have to make a choice. Like some nice you're not going to sleep, probably more than any other student, but like comparing yourself to other students isn't going to help you either.

40:46 You just have to take your situation and understand this is the deck that I was given and I'm they're gonna play the game or I'm gonna fold. So yeah, I agree with Crystal one hundred percent, and I'm sorry Christe. I hope there's a shining light I are in. Definitely more supportive services, hopefully more growth in child support. I know scholarships are more in doubtly including that in the reward, so definitely hope it's in your way. Yeah, yeah, but yeah, I agree with Crystal said a lot of not comparing yourself to students, but something I faced with in my early years undergrad.

41:29 A lot of the classes I had were like just me alone, native one outpost student and Kim oh Kim, and I didn't really get the support I hoped I could get from those classes, like going into tutoring and going to TA and instruct your hours, Like I know it's basic information, but sometimes you have to go out of your way of we teaching yourself and that always is very hard to do for me. So going to my undergrad I was pre med going in starting out at a Great Advisor Jersey. She was amazing. She helped me a lot in networking, like I said, for the Talking Medicine circle. But when she retired, I kind of was left in the dark a little bit of going further in premed. So my gears shifted a little bit, My point of view shifted more into public health. So that's where the whelm of like, although I'm not doing premed officially, I'm helping a way of health in some shape or form. So I guess kind of a solution to others who may be thinking, like if there's a certain field that you felt was your calling, but sometimes it can come with a different message, I would say, don't be afraid listening to that message and just kind of think like you're something better coming out of it. So I would say, just flow with it, see what comes of it, and you know, a greater opportunity cre even come your way, So just don't I would say, don't be closing your eyes to all opportunities coming your way.

42:54 And one thing too that I learning now and my graduate journey is learning to balance challenge and support. So kind of like what Crystal said, there is going to be decisions you're gonna have to make. Like one thing for me is always is just self affordability. It's hard to live as an adult. It's so expensive. Who said this was easy? But there's always a bunch of ways to gain support for that. So there's chances are that there might be a loan in there, but there's a lot of ways to combat it, like during work steady, which is what I did my senior year in undergrad and currently now I'm working full time, and so your skills of learning tend to improve over time. I would say, just be open to some challenges and there will be always ways to improve it and solutions standing by or is looking for you to try. So just balancing again, challenge support is something I've learned to still learning too, so it's wanted to share that with others. That's a good points there have Breedy, Do you have anything you wanted to add Yeah, it's kind of just like an addition to miniques.

44:05 But I think for me, just feeling like I had a place to go and I had a solid I know that everybody told me, oh, you're going to change your major like four or five times, and I was like, no, I don't say that. That's so scary. But I just learned to trust the process to continue to choose opportunities and things that I have fulfilled my passions and my dreams in life, and again just trying new things, putting yourself in new places. Growth is uncomfortable, and that was something I really had to get over because for a long time, I was like, oh, if it doesn't feel right, it's not for me.

44:45 But you know, I was kind of keeping myself in a circle and doing that. So once I broke out of that, I kind of realized how much more I can do as an indigenous person. You know, I really love that quote, you know, for the generations four and after us, because if we don't start taking up these spaces and trying all these new things, others won't follow. So thank you for sharing that. And like you're mentioned, breeze is growth and that's all we're all doing is just growing in these this card game, you know, like Crystals mentioned, you know, we're all you know, we're all growing together and trying to make this work as much as we can, and I also want to acknowledge, you know, if anybody who's listening out there, if you've graduated from high school or middle school or you know, congrats, my son graduated from fifth grade, so he's going to sixth grade, so graduates. Yeah, so there's a lot of you know, when you're out there listening, you know, those are big steps to high school, community college. You know, we might be university students, but I think a lot of these things entail each other and those are big, big significance to where you know, like we're saying, generations that come, whether you get the advocacy from listening to platforms such as ours, or if you're just like always interested in the work that Monique or Crystal is doing, you know, there's always room to always like gain knowledge and that's in that sense and learn someone you know that is like you or you know you can see yourself in. And that's sort of another another

46:20 response that we got, you know, was like they were excited to be accepted. You know, they just graduated. They they're having a lot put ahead of them and then like to be ignored by the university, you know for their issue for things that their barriers and challenges to be ignored. You know, here they are getting accepted to college, but then now you know they're unaware that, you know, when things these challenges happened, there was no support. So I think that's where we like, yeah, there there, congrats, you got you got into you know, hey, Sue or you know Harvard, and then you get there. You know, there's also these other reflecting door that it's sometimes it's not is what we seem to be until we're actually in those particular spaces, and they were like, man, it's hard, I have to work two jobs. You know. It's just like that they want to see the glorified PhD or STEM, but all the work that it takes to get there is a lot. And some of the responses were just like, you know, institutional barriers I thought would be I would feel supported, you know, what is this? Why am I facing this? And others were saying like fiddly connected with one professor because she was the only native professor there. So it's like, wow, it makes me.

47:31 We reflect on how privilege we are at ASCU to have a lot of these faculty and driven things paving the way things. You know, However, there are still some barriers that I think, you know, I've personally faced to where it's just like m yes and no, you know, oh he's great. How does it feel working all right? You know Christa knows, you know, doing his joke all the time. You know, we we we see the light of everything that's out there, and then it's like, let's tell you really how it is. You know, like, yeah, this is it's okay. So and I'm sure that's like anywhere anywhere. It's just like how natives are in institutions. You know, we're all doing our own thing. But I really wanted to overcome those barriers, and so I guess lastly, and and this is also a big one that I think we when we put out the poll for the Google doc, we wanted to end on a really positive note on things that are our listeners and viewers have shared with us. You know, some words of advice of encouragement that you know, you two would like to share for future Native students UM coming into fields, coming into different areas, you know, social sciences, science, UM.

48:47 Sort of what advice or words of encouragement would you like to give to other currently or future students that you want to share it. So one thing that I will say is anything that you do in life is not easy, no matter how you trick yourself into thinking about things. And so that's the same for our higher education as well. But there's a lot of doors that can open if you go to higher education. There's all the doors if you just work. In general, it could be going into the job market, it could be going into trade school, it could be going to higher education. It doesn't matter. But as Indigenous people's because of those we're not like Western or ideologies are not the same, and so we don't think that to be successful or to contribute to community, you have to have a degree.

49:38 But we do know that we have roles in our community, and those roles always include working, and that's to advance in better community. And so as long as you maintain that knowledge of those roles and how that looks for you and how that contributes and gives back to your community, I think that's something think that's going to be beneficial for you, your family, your tribe, and then even for the children that haven't even been born yet. But that also encompasses higher education. If that's your decision, and it can't open up a lot of doors. Thanks Christa. I love that. I would say to former graduates to middle school and high schoolers. Small advice that I wish that was shared with me is don't let the small steps overwhelm you. College planning can take a lot of thought and a lot of like what is the financial aid? How do you write a resume? How do you start a cover letter? Even applying to your first summer job, And there's a lot of steps included. But don't overthink it and don't overwhelm yourself on how much needs to get done. It's just a matter of starting it. So I would say one quote was shared with me, is it takes eighty percent more energy to start something in twenty percent to finish it. So just kind of remember that, I keep it in your thoughts that it takes less energy or more energy to start it and then less energy to finish it. So all the small steps of around you. And something else too is ask questions to

51:09 seek to understand. I was always afraid to ask questions. Even to this day. I even get scared to ask if there's can I get extra napkin at a restaurant? As far as I go, like, don't be afraid to ask questions. Everybody always wants to know about something, and as kind of formally mentioned in the beginning of the podcast, is drop knowledge to others. You know, there's gonna be always that student next to you or someone next to me that wants to know what your T shirt is, your jewelry, why are your skin is a little bit darker than there's so we'll be free to showcase or tell them where you're from. So at one hundred percent they probably won't know. So drop some knowledge. And then to all of the scholars, graduates, college and beyond, were our students for life, no matter how much we don't like it, we're always learning every day.

52:02 And I want to give a shout out to my partner because he always helped me that every day a chance. He always says, I'm a student for life, So a learner for life. No matter if you're in school or not in school, you're learning something new every day, So embrace it, empower it, and be a resource to yourself. That was really good. Do you have any you know, words of encouragement? Yeah? Nothing too long. I definitely agree with everything you know. Crystal and learning kids said, I think We'll definitely help a lot of people and would have helped me if I still in school, will help me right now. But I think we should just all remember that learning and education is a privilege, and so with that, you know, as I have continued my education, I've been so grateful for what I have learned, not only for myself and who I can you help along the way, but for people I can now educate and help also guide along the way, because I think, you know, like this whole podcast episode is about are our experiences are very unique, and so I think sharing them and you know, like when you said talking to other people, just getting to know you know, those around you, those in your community, really strengthens you and opened new doors. Awesome. Yeah, those are very powerful words, and I guess I can share a little bit of whatever responses from the listeners have shared from what their words of encouragement is.

53:30 We have adapt and quickly adjust to every changing environment. We have do to be afraid to ask for help and ask questions. Continue your goals, don't hesitate to dominate, be yourself, be humble, have faith, stay in your path. All will fall into place. God bless and we don't feel like you have to have everything planned out. I would say, don't let the small details overwhelm you. Take it step by step, and don't be afraid to ask or help. I ask for help starting for my advisors. Professors. Resident advisers are in friends. I have made so many friends during my college journey that I'm so grateful for. You get to broad your interests so wide that you not only figure out who you want to be, but you also become gifted with the experiences that you help that help you reflect so much on your small and big goals. And then we don't give up, keep going. And then one last one is pretty pretty long, but I think there's some really powerful words in it. I encourage Native students to dream big. It is easy to feel discourage in academic spaces. I want them to feel confident their decisions and feel excited for whatever path they choose to take. There's going to be many hardships, most expected, but there are a lot of great opportunities and friends you meet along the way. You'll discover new things about yourself as you navigate these challenges and make some mistakes along the way. My biggest piece of advice for any Native student to make sure in

55:02 whatever space that you're in, you're expressing who you are. This is something I struggled with a lot. I begin you're lit belittling my identity experience is an intellect just to accommodate the people around. Don't do that. Who you are as an individual is so special. Don't let anyone or anything take that away. So I almost started crying there. That's that's a lot that was. That's a good one. Yeah, So at that, I think that's a really a special way for those of you who filled out our form. Thank you all so much. Muss up with and we are really happy to have these two awesome guests here alongside with me and and breathe and it never stops here. So we could also if you are interested in learning a little bit more and the work that Monique and Crystal are doing, we could also share this their information and their emails. You know, if you are in the Tucson area, you know, let them know when they're in the area and want to know more about you know, their PhD journey or you know Monique and Stem. You know, there's are very challenging areas and we want to make sure that we're uplifting our students and the next generation. And if you are interested in college in general, you know we can always have those experiences expressed within ourselves. And what does it mean to be an indigenous student as a you know, as a grad student or just an undergrad. What are those experiences like? So you all have any last words or anything you

56:36 won't want to share before we wrap it up here, I just want to echo that amazing ending posts that if you have a chance to put that on one of your guys as amazing graphics and share it for the audience or anybody that uses your guys as page, I would do that because it really touches a lot of points that we try to touch today, and then more so people can always reflect back on that they need. I just thought that was amazing and I'm so thankful for the person who shared that. Yeah, just ahead, to all our guests and to our presenters today, thank you so much, Napoleon Free and to everyone on Young Voices, I thank you so much for the invite. It's really honorable to share experience and always feel free to reach out anytime. So definitely, I hope all we's here today, am IKT you all and hopefully inspired to many people. So thank you all again. Thank you. Yeah, I just had to say that. I hope everybody enjoyed the podcast. I hope this gave you something to think about, gave you something to motivate you. If you're doing a homework right now, finish that paper you can do it, and then also keep an eye out for any more opportunities to share your stories or insight. I know we're thinking about putting more episodes out like this, so I'm very excited about that.

58:06 Thank you all so much for joining us, and that Young Voices podcast will definitely be sharing some information in a post and as well as a recommendation from Crystal Tina is our executive producer who is in the background when the logistics want to Thank you all for listening with us. Thank you, Thank you for tuning in to today's episode. Onto Young Voices. Make sure to go check out the other episodes. You can find us on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your podcasts.