Ep. 42 Defining Indigenous Self-Determination

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For full disclosure. The information discussed
in this podcast is based on the views

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and experiences of the guests and the
hosts. The content here is for general

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educational purposes only. Content warning.
The following contains discussions that describe racial discrimination

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and violent acts toward Native people that
may be harmful or traumatizing to some audiences.

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Please take care while listening. Hi, Kanna, I'm Tina Zek,

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producer of the podcast. Thank you
so much for joining us this morning.

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I've been doing a lot of research
and just found out a lot of great

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work that you've done. But I'm
glad that you're able to come and be

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here with us on the podcast Scoop
Gosh, I'm Chuggate, Napoleon Marietta,

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I need Wood, Autamna auntum and
pepashani Amjad alkham At Autum chuk chun chud

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Habak Ski heat them So. Hello, Keana. My name is Napoleon Marrietta.

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I'm from Health River. I just
graduated prior to this from a su

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in my undergrad and justice studies in
American Indian Studies. Did finish my masters

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two in one in American Indian Studies
with emphasis on Indigenous rights of social justice

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and another one in public administration.
So been around quite a while and really

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happy to have you here and talk
about some of the work that you do.

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I am sort of familiar with with
border towns. I have met folks

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from the Red Nation before. I've
known Nick and doctor Melanie. So thank

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you so much for being here.
Oh yeah, Nina hit Awkward, Sisana

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Schmid, Hello, thank you first
of all for having me on the podcast.

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Also congratulations Napoleon graduated. Always love
seeing let need people be successful in

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the academy. It's crazy, But
a little bit about me. So my

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homelands. I'm Dannette. I am
Navajo. According to Navolis, where your

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mother is from is where you originate. So my family lives in Newco,

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Mexico, which is about thirty minutes
outside Shipbrock and I grew up in Farmington,

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New Mexico. And it's had a
lot of impact on the things I

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do and things that I decided to
study and go into. But of course

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we're going to be talking all about
that today, but about the work that

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I do. So I do a
lot of things. I kind of broadly.

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I've worked in the field of insist
social justice and education in different spheres

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which include law, policy, racial
and climate justice. At my university,

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I'm currently a grad student, so
I'm studying politics in education at Columbia University

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and I'm currently on a fellowship.
And at this fellowship, I co teach

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in creat curriculum for high school students
in Harlem that centers on how to be

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an activist with a new community,
learning about civil rights, history of what

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makes up Harlem. And I'm also
a research assistant where I work with a

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legal professor in education and this organization, it's called Center for Educational Equity.

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We advocate for children's rights to education
via state constitutional law, upgrading, updating

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financial aid formulas, and also side
projects of increasing media literacy and all soecific

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engagement. But outside of the academic
sphere, I also am doing other things

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as well, So I'm a curriculum
specialist for this Bipop youth organization called stard

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Empowerment, and we look at providing
social justice tools for youth to learn about

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climate education but also to become environmental
justice leaders and to pursue their own organizing

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within their communities and empower them to
to give them those tools. So I

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focus more on the indigenous centered but
just focusing on how Indigenous people fit within

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this unique sphere in environmental justice issues. My great curriculum centered around that.

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But outside of that, I do
freelance writing. I work a lot in

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the social media space. So I've
been utilizing social media since about like twenty

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twenty to create free educational resources available
to the public to teach about different indigenous

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issues. I've partnered with other bigger
social need organizations, so places like Intersectional

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Environmentalist Feminist Impact, as well as
starting to create more like longer based freelance

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writing. So I just partnered with
the manage in five to talk about some

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of the environmental themes plan stewardship that
happens within Killers of the Flower Moon and

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just bringing those lens into those spaces. So what do you do to take

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care of yourself? Yeah, I
would say a lot of it's Stanley phone

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calls, Like I've been away from
home like for a while, haven't been

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home like a long period of time. I think the long to sit home

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in the past couple of years has
been like two or three weeks. But

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it's a lot of phone calls and
creating safe spaces that I'm at. So

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I have a couple of closet friends
with me in the city that I'm able

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to talk with and engage with,
because these issues are hard to talk about,

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and it's also a lot harder when
you when you're the one that's designated

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to speak about these issues and to
have to engage with other people who don't

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agree with those opinions or don't agree
with your beliefs. And so I do

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my best to talk with my parents. I think I parents have been my

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rock. I mean, they've lived
through everything that I'm going through. There,

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of course there are some differences,
but they're the knowledge keepers. They

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are the ones that keep me grounded. I call my grandma, I call

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it I got called my grandma.
They great anancies as they call them my

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siblings. I text all the time, so I just staying in talk with

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family helps a lot. Awesome.
Wow, I don't know if that's part

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of your freelance work, but you
did some an article with the Native Online

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News. I believe so a lot
of what I write about comes from the

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academic sphere, and I want to
make that public to other people. I

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feel there's such a closed door of
understanding law and policy for Indigenous communities that

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I just wanted to like break that
and say, Indigenous people should be knowing

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about this, and you know,
not indigenous peoples too, because they're contributing

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to the proper we should know what
you're doing. Yeah, well, it's

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great to meet you and learn all
about the work that you do. Bri

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originally brought us all together, and
she brought about the work specifically on your

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work with tribal reservation border towns,
which to me, when I hear the

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work, just because where I'm from, when I hear the word border town,

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I automatically think towns that are alongside
the US Mexico border. But in

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the notes that Bri and Napoleon put
together that it's somewhat of a relatively new

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concept to indigenous studies that responds to
the ensuing violence against Native Americans and the

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work or your project title, the
Formation of Tribal Reservation border Towns Navigating the

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identity and engine killing spaces. I
guess first differentiating the term border towns from

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what I know it from versus what
you're familiar with, can you talk a

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little bit about that My interduction to
what a border town was actually And I'll

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talk of this later on came from
this book called The Broken Circle written by

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Rodney Born Rodney Barker, and in
this book he describes border town pretty vaguely,

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saying that it's a place where you
have these two different communities that are

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separate from one another, different cultural
values, different ideas, and many in

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the ways. Like that's true for
different borders of the Mexico and so called

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like US border. What makes bordered
towns with tribal reservations so interesting is that

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this isn't with one nation state,
it's the same person that it's only one

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entity that is pretty much controlling or
has controlled. I mean, it could

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be argued with like the US Mexican
border. US has a lot of on

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what's happening on those borders too.
But I think it's interesting to put this

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in context within the United States.
So I want to go to I believe

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like the Red Nation Rising book,
which puts the first book to talk about

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reservation border towns. I believe their
definition is the best explanation of what this

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is. So Red Nation Rising.
This book is written by of course Nick

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Estis, Melanie Gazzi, Jennifer Dnadel, and David Correa. So they say

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the words that order in town are
together, so they're all one cookies in

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word, and they're combined to describe
the relationships that are connected with in these

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spaces. So I'll put it in
quote. What they say is like in

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quote the name itself and now in
town adjectively modified by the border end quote.

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Yet this their definition goes beyond this
and says that it is a truly

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a relationship where the contradictions of Stettler
colonialism are merged and show themselves. So

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from that, they say that border
towns are any white settlements because the purpose

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of settlements is that to eliminate borders
and to secure their land. So differentiating

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that from what we see with the
US and Mexican border, I would argue

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that they're pretty much connected and they're
an extension of one another. You know,

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you have a lot of the indigenous
tribes and groups that are down there

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near the border. After Post try
jaup Hibbago, they were pretty much rendered

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to whatever said territory that they were
put in. So like, for example,

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we have indigenous people that ended up
on Mexico. They were automatically categorized

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as Mexican and they lost all indigenous
identity. Similar to what we'd get like

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people who went on like the US
side, And I actually wrote up paper

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talking about this unique relationship that happens
within border towns. And you know,

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right now, there's like ways that
people have tried to have Indigenous peoples in

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those areas have like more like the
free movement spaces because they aren't necessarily have

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those same political relationships with their nation
states. So one of the ways that

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they've tried to navigate this is through
enhance tribal identification cards, and that in

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itself is a huge violation of privacy, right, So there are these like

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little cards you get with like these
microtips and then that monitor your movement,

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so somebody is watching you move across
from order to border. So you're having

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that in that area. But within
border towns, I think it's really interesting

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because it's a sense of racialization that
happens in those spaces, rendering racial violence

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to Indigenous and Native folks. And
I've seen that very apparent to my movement

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out within the East Coast. You
know, within the East Coast, there's

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a course Indigenous presence, and I'm
in a community with a lot of Indigenous

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spoke. But when you meet and
engage with other people, there's no assumption

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that you are native or that you're
indigenous. It's very much like, oh,

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like your Spanic Latina and like there's
many like I'm going to see you

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guys have been spoken to in like
Spanish like all the time, but there's

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no assumption that you're Native American.
And I've at least like fifty plus times

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I've been told, oh, you're
the first Native American I've met. Rather

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as in Bordertown, they know you, they know what you look like,

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they know how they have this assumption
and stereotype of the way you're supposed to

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act. And I've experienced it in
and outside of the education system. So

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it's very much you're racialized in the
space and that. But just because of

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how you look and how you identified, there's this automatic assumption that we get

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of how indigenous peoples are supposed to
act, and that's what's happening in those

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different border town spaces. That's a
really good point because I know, like

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in Uh, I guess for me
like border towns when I think about that,

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like obviously the Mexico and the US
border, and then obviously having the

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third entity, which is the nation, So there's like three entities that you're

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facing. And with all of that
is like what you're talking about is like

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the identity of indigenous people, right, So it's like I'm a citizen of

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the nation, or I'm a US
citizen or a Mexico Mexican American, like

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all those identities. But then what
if someone is you know from back and

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forth, So that identity is interesting
that you're talking about because like then you

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mentioned like how in some states,
in some areas, you know, you're

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already perceived. They already have a
perceived notion, you know, whether you're

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walking into a grocery store or something, they already know to surveil you.

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How they already know to have that
unique relationship already with you when you're going

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across whether it's the state line or
whether it's international line. So that was

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really interesting because like when I think
of border towns, I think of like

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like urban cities, so like Phoenix, tribal communities that are occupied in like

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local cities like Scottsdale, like these
very heavily, and of course like New

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Mexico like Gallup. I'm sure there
is a huge one, you know,

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Albuquerque, Santa Fe and like where
the reservation is like is a is sort

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of that whole boundary line. It
literally is a border. You know,

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like here's a border, y'all are
supposed to only shop there. And like

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because we're out in Heale River,
we're close to Chandler where there's like mostly

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retirees and people who have like,
you know, their own like senior living

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houses and they have their golf carts
and things. Compared to like Phoenix,

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where you have a high population of
an Indigenous people from different nations, there's

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a tremendous amount of unsheltered folks.
So like that's a really interesting point about

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when you're talking about identity and different
spaces and like experiences like your own where

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you know, you're in the East
Coast. One of the things that I

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was even told here like people didn't
know Indigenous people existed on the East Coast

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still over in any of the East
like because of what happened free contact,

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like a lot of them were wiped
out. And then you look at like

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some of the planes tribes and communities, they're like you go there and you

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already know your native, Like,
oh, there's a high population of Natives

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that live there. You know,
so many tribal communities and that's unique.

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Gossil like with Arizona was obviously having
some of the largest communities here. It's

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an interesting point that you're making because
like when I was thinking about border Town,

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I was like, man understanding like
our ruralization of just being on the

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reservations that are you know, how
Gallup has a unique relationship and what happened

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in the history there. So I
guess like another thing I wanted to ask

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is like, sort of since the
activism that has happened in a lot of

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like places like these major urban cities
where the importance of bringing awareness and the

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identity in your line of work,
Like, where has that shined through,

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what are some active changes that are
happening, you know during all of these

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like foundes that have you know,
because there's like the active is in part,

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and then there's this weird unique law
legal thing and then like we're like

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the future of it, you know, Because that's sort of my question.

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Yeah, So I guess I can
start off with like the historical activism,

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leaving into now because you mentioned gaut
has a really history of border town violence

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and this was actually my introduction into
the American Indian Movement and learning about how

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that evolved over time. So,
of course the American Indian Movement founding founding

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members Russell Beans, Demis Banks.
You also have some really cool Indigenous revolutionary

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matriors. I've been reflecting on this
month looking at the Donnald thunder Hawk Killis

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young gent McCloud, who are also
part of the American Indian Movement. But

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their cause was looking of course,
stemmed out of the Civil rights movement,

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where we're having a lot of awareness
of the injustice happening to people of color,

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and so their movements stemmed from that
type of atmosphere looking at the injustices

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happening to Indigenous folks in particular within
these regions, these border town areas,

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and one of the catalysts of that, I think of I'll just explain a

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little bit about who Larry Casus was. So Larry Casus University of New Mexico,

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student of heavy activists who advocated for
the rights of Indigenous and Native books

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and with What's Hope. So what
happened to Larry Castus so in the region

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of Gallup. Galup is like about
two or so hours from where I grew

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up, in Farmington. It's a
huge interception to where you get like all

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of the major highways. Basically,
if you just want to move across the

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state from Mexico to Arizona, you're
passing through Gallup at some point. So

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it's become a hub for that.
But it's also where you have a lot

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of different trading posts that are happening. I talked a little bit about make

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pisis, but trade had plays a
tremendous impact on order chouts because trade.

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This is where trade happened. This
is where white settlers and indigenous peoples met

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each other. And that's also a
part of white settlement. You know,

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white people setting up these trade and
commerce and economic areas to build their profits,

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to religious people to travel to these
areas to like trade and try to

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buy. But in Gallup, of
course, on the Navajo Nation, we

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had had a law that pivoted alcohol
sales. So what better way for white

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settlers to make money than to set
up alcohol bars in areas right outside travel

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reservations. So in Gallup there was
the mayor. His name was I met

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Garcia, names e met Garcia,
and since Larry Casseus, he was a

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university in New Mexican University in New
Mexican student and Garcia was actually going to

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be appointed to the board of regents
for the university. And Garcia had advocated

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or like indigenous rites and like the
elimination of alcohol. But he was an

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owner of this bar that was in
Gallop in that area, and so Cazus

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was like, no, no,
no, no, We're not gonna like

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to get away with this, and
so they had sent up in staged kidnapping.

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And David Correa has like a really
good book about everything and talks about

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the whole event, but it was
to say they were ultimately stopped at police

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and their Caseus was not killed,
and he was only nineteen nineteen years old,

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very young, and there's a lot
of things that Capita went behind his

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case that were unaccounted for. There
are some reports of like him trying to

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student himself and which were not true. And also like after the event,

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there was this killing image and of
his of him and a bodybag with police

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standing over him, and this was
published in the Gallop Independent, which is

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like the local newspaper at the time, and so it was just gross.

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And so the American Indian Movement came
and started protesting on that area. Re

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late this iss and this is think
this is a very similar situation to what

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happened in Farmington. So in Farmington, this was nineteen seventy four, three

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naval men were found and murdered.
It was grotesque. I looked at the

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case file and it shows all of
the horrible, relicious things that were done

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to their bodies. And this was
done by high school students, the same

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high school that I attended and went
too. And this came out as a

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result of what they call engine rolling, and that's where the title of my

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thesis came from. The use of
engine in that sense, Indian rolling was

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we're just going like the ride of
passage for high school students. It was

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similar to like like a sporting event, or like something that needed to be

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done in order to be accepted within
the community. And it involved eating and

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stealing items of Indigenous people who were
either intoxicated, elderly, or just couldn't

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defund themselves. And before Indigenous peoples
who had to rely on quarter towns to

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get by, to get different supplies
for the weekends, or they needed to

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get just anything that wasn't available in
the reservation, they would go to border

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Town support. So after they ended
up finding like the high school students were

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guilty for those both for those murders, but they weren't sent to prison.

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They were sent to jail. They
were sent to former Terai school. And

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like during the Civil Rights his dream
of this became like a realization of the

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I'll just explain it to where you
have sentencing of people of color are more

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harsh than sentencing of non white folk. So the American Indie movement got wind

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of this atrocity that was happening with
in Farmington, and they had came in

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and they started marketing downtown, demanding
for these changes happened in the community and

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to re evaluate everything that was going
on. So after they had guns staged

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the protests, there was a riot
that broke out and this riot there was

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tear gas. People are arrested,
and this called for a major reevaluation or

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just a conversation of what was happening
in Farmington. So they had brought in

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this, they brought in a lot
of condissions. So they brought in the

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Human Rights Commission to do an investigation
of Farmington and they gathered everything what they

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call it report a conflict of cultures, talking about the political economic history of

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Farmington leading into the events that sparked
this outrage. And so they do a

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bunch of investigations in a lot of
areas. So they look at the criminal

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justice system, they look at the
health system, mental physical behavior programs located

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in the city. And from this
report they start implementing some changes in it.

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So we get some more health programs
that are available for not a little

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people. They're supposed to be this
more translation areas for them to be able

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to read things. Just bring in
this sort of like multicultural lens, I

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would say, into the area.
And although they established all these programs,

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any program that doesn't have a good
foundational support or understanding of the people serving

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aren't good. So one of the
major things mentioned earlier was talking about offering

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translation services. But recently, like
I'm forgetting which year this happened, but

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it was really recent in Farmington and
at the health hospital a patient had passed

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not patients away due to a misdiagnosis
because they weren't given a Navajo interpreter.

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And Bombington, like a border town
that lives in the center of two HS

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places, couldn't find a Navajo interpreter
for that patient in between them is just

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a huge injustice and also flat out
refuses to serve Natives and Indigenous books.

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So there's still a lot of work
that is going on. But Jennifer nes

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don it Del I look up through
her a lot. She's the first person

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to ever have a PhD. But
she's also a scholar in organizing an activists

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who's worked in and outside of this
space. She is one of the boards

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on she could chair a board very
what position she has, but she's on

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the Navajo Nation Human Rights Commission,
and this is the first of its kind

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with any tribal nation in the soul
called the United States to have a humans

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Rights Commission, and it's stemmed out
of this finance now happening with in border

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towns. So it does allow now
to help people to go in and seek

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out Oftenian right see seek their rights
to this commission and to be able to

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evaluate it in a way that the
US will somewhat sort of listen to or

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some are obligated to listen to.
Thank you for sharing that, you know.

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When I was looking up your work, that's definitely one of the things

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I came across was a documentary of
just exactly what you're talking about on YouTube,

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and for those who are listening and
maybe interested in checking out that,

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I'll definitely add it a link to
it in the description so you can see

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for yourself the work that she's done
and just visualize and see everything. But

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it's tiedled the American Indian Movement a
Broken Circle. Thank you for talking about

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that, and I'm glad that I
was able to see it and learn about

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it. It is shocking, though, it really is. It's unfortunate.

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It's something I never knew that was
going on in that area, So thank

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you for making that known in public. Yeah, of course, that documentary

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actually came out of a high school
assignment one of my teachers. National History

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Day is like an academic competition.
You create a project based on historical event.

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There's a certain theme every year,
and so the year prior to that,

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I did it on the Indianmval Act. And so for this next year,

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after meeting my parents talking to me
about the Broken Circle and learning more

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about the American Indian Movement about the
suits, I wanted to do it on

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the Indian Removal Act, And at
first I wasn't really gonna I was gonna

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publish it on mtoo. I was
just like, I'll just leave it.

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This is just for academic competition.
But I was like, let's just publish

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it. Let's let's leave it online. Mainly because people featured in the documentary.

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So like he was my former middle
school teacher. He went to samed

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Peter dues Wood, he was in
there. He wanted access to see it

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so you can show it to some
of his class. One of the other

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people I interviewed, they were my
mom's ust to be coworkers, and they

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wanted to do it to others in
the high school. Teacher that proposed that

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I was leading all of the National
History Day stuff also wanted to keep it

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and to be able to teach it
to other people or to show other people.

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And so from there I just made
it hopefully available so anybody can watch

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it. Yeah, thank you for
that. It's huge, a lot of

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history and things that I didn't even
know about, intense and the reason why

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I brought up like some of the
activism stuff is like obviously some of the

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fields that I've learned about research and
have mentorship in, and so like when

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you're mentioning a lot of the work
that you're doing policy wise, curriculum wides

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youth, and so I've sort of
shifted a lot of geared towards the youth

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and how the youth can participate and
be a part of this these like movements

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that have happened. So my question
would be, like, since so much

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of the work that you've done is
and now like you're doing now children and

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youth and then finding their voice,
Like, what are some for our listeners,

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you know, who are out there? How do they get involved?

336
00:29:06.920 --> 00:29:08.960
What do they do at their local
schools? Like how do how are the

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youth, you know, Native youth
they're feeling these days you know, and

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then seeing sort of them transform into
you know, having that voice and empowering

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like what we do to empower these
these things? Just like youth live along

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you know, they live along the
border towns they live you know, the

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kids are the ones that experience a
lot of this too. So like in

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your field of work, what are
some ways that you know, having it

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involved and finding that voice for Indigenous
youth. It's hard maybe because I recognize

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that I grew up in household and
also had a lot of support that was

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actively but also a lot of support, virtually being connected to my community to

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like my extended family, and also
just having those cultural practices and praying data

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pretty early age. So I always
take that in mind whenever I talk with

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different other youths than people to talk
with them because we're we're all come with

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a different experience in these border towns. I think first is get educated.

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It doesn't have to be in the
academic sense, doesn't have to be in

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those silos that a lot of schools
put on you, because obviously, like

352
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the topic I'm talking about isn't taught
in school. Someone was gonna teach me

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it in my classroom. It's something
I had to go seek out and to

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explore, and it wasn't the sense
like it wasn't taught before. I actually

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learned this throughout my research that the
reading about the violence that was happening in

356
00:30:41.759 --> 00:30:45.279
the border towns I actually used to
be a requirement or it got barred by

357
00:30:45.359 --> 00:30:49.799
some teacher or some family people or
some white people in the community. But

358
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yeah, going back to that,
if you find something that really interesting doesn't

359
00:30:55.799 --> 00:30:57.359
have to be in academics. If
you really like reading, go read.

360
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I think there's a lot of insteads
of people telling you how you should act

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and what you shouldn't be doing.
No, Like, if you love making

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art, continue making art. Just
do something that you like. I think

363
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I tell that to any people who
want to be activists, who want to

364
00:31:14.440 --> 00:31:18.279
go into this field, Like there's
so many ways to advocate for your community

365
00:31:18.400 --> 00:31:22.680
that we don't think of beginning.
Like we see people going out and protesting

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00:31:22.839 --> 00:31:27.319
and like that's great, like on
the ground work, but we need people

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in the education system. We need
Native and Indigenous teachers. We need native

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of our teachers. I mean,
we're made to create things to explore.

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So yeah, the first thing I
say, just find your pofe. Find

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00:31:41.279 --> 00:31:47.640
something that you like to do,
but take up those spaces that supposedly aren't

371
00:31:47.759 --> 00:31:52.359
meant for you and be there.
I talk with my dad and my mom

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00:31:52.400 --> 00:31:56.799
a lot about is I like seeing
like people surprised at what Native people can

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do. I think it's one of
the things I or one of the things

374
00:32:00.519 --> 00:32:05.400
that I love to see is Native
people for brothers wrong. Like we know

375
00:32:05.720 --> 00:32:08.599
how smart we are, you know
how creative we are, we know what's

376
00:32:08.759 --> 00:32:15.400
right, And to see just those
spaces of shop, you know, one

377
00:32:15.440 --> 00:32:19.640
of the fascinating things when I was
going to school, was like hearing that

378
00:32:20.039 --> 00:32:23.200
the Indigenous excellence is like you know, American Indian studies is everywhere. Like

379
00:32:23.279 --> 00:32:27.039
you throw a rock and you hit
AIS, what's your major? AIS?

380
00:32:27.079 --> 00:32:30.240
Saw what's up? But you hit
like masters or people like even undergrad in

381
00:32:30.319 --> 00:32:36.480
psychology or digital culture or aerospace engineer
or electrical engineer. You're like, what

382
00:32:36.680 --> 00:32:38.480
what is that about? You know? And that's cool because like you're mentioning,

383
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like how like Native people like we
get involved in all these different things

384
00:32:42.920 --> 00:32:45.839
and then we're finding that there's always
that question is like how did you want

385
00:32:45.880 --> 00:32:49.279
to get involved in that? You
know, Like that's very very passionate about

386
00:32:49.319 --> 00:32:52.279
it. And so I always remember
those times just meeting those those different relationships

387
00:32:52.319 --> 00:32:57.400
and how important community is, especially
when we're talking about some of these harsh,

388
00:32:57.880 --> 00:33:00.559
you know, histories, especially when
it's happening still. You know,

389
00:33:00.680 --> 00:33:05.599
like when we do this research to
white folks like our people institutions like oh

390
00:33:05.680 --> 00:33:08.319
it's some good historical context. It's
like it's actually if you go down to

391
00:33:08.359 --> 00:33:12.440
Gallop or something and you go with
me, you'll probably be watched, or

392
00:33:12.519 --> 00:33:14.920
you know, you go to the
bashes our safeway, you know, we

393
00:33:14.960 --> 00:33:17.799
will probably be watched in Scottsdale.
So these are you know, real life

394
00:33:17.880 --> 00:33:22.079
experiences that we bring to the table
other than you know, like oh yeah,

395
00:33:22.279 --> 00:33:24.680
indigenous people have it hard and all
this other stuff. But the focus

396
00:33:24.799 --> 00:33:28.799
is morally, I guess, less
than just like beating down a lot of

397
00:33:28.880 --> 00:33:31.839
ponents. But it's actually showing like
where we're upgrooding a lot of our knowledge

398
00:33:32.079 --> 00:33:36.599
toward to be teachers and things of
that nature. And so I appreciate that

399
00:33:36.839 --> 00:33:39.240
too, because like, the youth
are so important, and sometimes it's as

400
00:33:39.279 --> 00:33:43.559
they're growing, you know, and
learning about different things like that are not

401
00:33:43.680 --> 00:33:46.640
taught in school or like you there
are things that are taught that are misinformation,

402
00:33:47.160 --> 00:33:51.119
you know, learning about things taking
and all this stuff, and you're

403
00:33:51.440 --> 00:33:53.839
wondering why uncle and the teacher gone
to argument, you know, like why

404
00:33:53.920 --> 00:33:57.480
why are you guys arguing? You
know, because Thanksgiving is like you know,

405
00:33:57.559 --> 00:33:59.839
people can test it, you know, all these things that are wrongly

406
00:34:00.079 --> 00:34:02.400
thought in our schools and things.
So yeah, thank you so much,

407
00:34:02.440 --> 00:34:07.119
and I also want to plug in. Bree was like talking to me and

408
00:34:07.400 --> 00:34:08.639
she said, oh yeah, Keanu
p And I was like, I think

409
00:34:08.719 --> 00:34:13.440
that I'm not much of a TikToker. I'm not a native TikToker or whatever,

410
00:34:13.920 --> 00:34:16.760
but I think I seen you talk
about one that was fairly recent.

411
00:34:16.920 --> 00:34:21.360
Now I'm wrong, I'm sorry.
There was one about identity. I don't

412
00:34:21.360 --> 00:34:22.960
remember, but it was fairly recent, and then I was like, oh,

413
00:34:23.199 --> 00:34:25.559
that's cool. So then I was
like watching a lot of education,

414
00:34:25.840 --> 00:34:30.159
like what you were talking about and
your tiktoks. I think that's also another

415
00:34:30.239 --> 00:34:32.840
way that youth are engaged is some
of it is cringe, but some of

416
00:34:32.920 --> 00:34:37.719
it is really like good stuff that
people are talking about because a lot of

417
00:34:37.800 --> 00:34:40.360
our youth are watching that, even
me, Like who's turning thirty today?

418
00:34:40.440 --> 00:34:44.400
And like I still slide through and
see some of all the ones that are

419
00:34:44.800 --> 00:34:47.079
really good at talking about border towns, talking about identity, you know,

420
00:34:47.239 --> 00:34:50.800
things like that. So I just
wanted to plug in your If you all

421
00:34:50.960 --> 00:34:55.079
listeners have following Keana, definitely follow
because this is good information. So if

422
00:34:55.119 --> 00:34:59.840
you had anything, yeah, definitely. I feel like the content that you

423
00:35:00.079 --> 00:35:05.239
put out there's very informative, very
educational. Following your Instagram, you put

424
00:35:05.280 --> 00:35:12.800
out just information that's not easily accessible
unless you're digging online. So thank you

425
00:35:13.039 --> 00:35:16.760
for putting in that work. And
simplifying some of this information as well,

426
00:35:16.920 --> 00:35:22.920
and that's also what we need to
help us to better understand the root of

427
00:35:22.440 --> 00:35:29.480
different causes or what's happening today and
the effects, whether it's environmental, politically

428
00:35:30.320 --> 00:35:35.360
in the world of activism, I
feel like you're definitely doing a really good

429
00:35:35.440 --> 00:35:37.800
job with what you're you're putting out
on your content. So thank you,

430
00:35:38.159 --> 00:35:43.800
Keianum. Thanks. It means a
lot. I always have like imposter syndrome,

431
00:35:44.320 --> 00:35:46.199
any of those spaces I'm like,
is it good? Is it not?

432
00:35:46.639 --> 00:35:52.199
Of like some people ask, like
I think people and they don't know,

433
00:35:52.480 --> 00:35:55.239
Like my social media is like a
lot of educational stuff, so I'm

434
00:35:55.239 --> 00:36:00.480
always when they ask can I follow
you? And I'm like, but I

435
00:36:00.599 --> 00:36:04.960
post this and this, but yeah, in a way like big journalists friends

436
00:36:05.000 --> 00:36:07.079
and they're like, oh, I'm
writing this piece and this piece, and

437
00:36:07.159 --> 00:36:08.320
they're like, you know, in
a way, you're kind of doing like

438
00:36:08.440 --> 00:36:12.639
journalism, and I'm like, what
do you mean. They're like, well,

439
00:36:12.760 --> 00:36:16.480
you every single like post you have
is it's a story. You're giving

440
00:36:16.559 --> 00:36:22.960
it context, you're giving research,
you're inserting quotes and pictures. That's journalism.

441
00:36:22.039 --> 00:36:25.960
And I'm like, oh wow,
but it's great, it's something that

442
00:36:27.119 --> 00:36:32.320
I like doing. And going back
to the topic of water towns, I

443
00:36:32.440 --> 00:36:39.280
was looking at this article online for
from High Country News and it was written

444
00:36:39.320 --> 00:36:46.280
by Klin good Luck and it's titled
The Everyday Violence of Indian Countries Watertime,

445
00:36:46.320 --> 00:36:53.039
and it talks about Zachary Bear Hills
and what he experienced, what he went

446
00:36:53.119 --> 00:37:00.239
through and part of that violent legacy
of Indian countries water towns. And so

447
00:37:00.400 --> 00:37:05.400
for those just to kind of go
back and for the listeners to get a

448
00:37:05.440 --> 00:37:10.559
little bit more of an understanding,
so the towns and cities outside Indian reservations

449
00:37:10.639 --> 00:37:19.000
where Indigenous and white residents live side
by side, and that the book read

450
00:37:19.119 --> 00:37:24.320
Nation Rising from Border Town Violence to
Native Liberation by Nick s this Militi,

451
00:37:24.440 --> 00:37:30.599
Kaozi, Jennifer naz Dale, and
David Korea. I believe it illuminates the

452
00:37:30.760 --> 00:37:37.719
long overlooked violence that has plagued any
in countries border towns from early settler colonialism

453
00:37:37.880 --> 00:37:45.360
days to today. So again,
if anyone out there wants to learn more,

454
00:37:45.519 --> 00:37:49.639
that's a book you should definitely check
out. Thank you Keana for introducing

455
00:37:49.800 --> 00:37:53.039
that as well in earlier in the
conversation. But I also wanted to share

456
00:37:53.079 --> 00:37:58.159
this quote because I thought, like
it's like pretty powerful and it's so simple.

457
00:37:58.760 --> 00:38:04.079
But this quote is they said that
the settler got the world, the

458
00:38:04.159 --> 00:38:09.559
Indian got the reservation. That's so
pretty pretty strong words, but definitely something

459
00:38:09.639 --> 00:38:15.960
to think about and consider. So
how can like future for the listeners out

460
00:38:16.000 --> 00:38:21.679
there, what people take from your
research for building on and more like for

461
00:38:21.840 --> 00:38:24.480
future research? Like you see you
achieved this, Now what can people do

462
00:38:24.599 --> 00:38:28.880
when they read and be like,
well, there's just so much like you

463
00:38:28.920 --> 00:38:30.519
know, as you break it down. You you did a really good job

464
00:38:30.559 --> 00:38:34.719
of breaking it down, you know, like jargon and everything like legally and

465
00:38:34.800 --> 00:38:38.360
everything else, so we can perceive
these high end like you know, definitions,

466
00:38:38.440 --> 00:38:43.199
But like for your research, would
you tell someone like me if I

467
00:38:43.320 --> 00:38:45.280
was willing to do more work on
border towns, like, oh, first

468
00:38:45.280 --> 00:38:49.239
of all, read this and then
like working, where would you give someone

469
00:38:49.360 --> 00:38:52.960
suggestions on like for building future research? You see the future from your research

470
00:38:53.119 --> 00:38:58.400
going. That's a good question,
and that's something that I've been questioning for

471
00:38:58.519 --> 00:39:01.400
a while. What wanted to do
my thesis and what I want to do

472
00:39:01.519 --> 00:39:06.480
with it after work, But the
conception of it, like I talked about

473
00:39:06.559 --> 00:39:08.880
why I want to try it about
word tones. But why I wanted to

474
00:39:09.039 --> 00:39:15.719
particularly focus on Douny these pieces because
I have a hard time navigating who I

475
00:39:15.880 --> 00:39:20.599
was in that space, so a
lot of codes witching in outside of school.

476
00:39:20.840 --> 00:39:23.480
But there were also things I didn't
realize that my parents did when I

477
00:39:23.599 --> 00:39:27.760
was growing up. So like my
parents could let me go to sleepovers,

478
00:39:28.360 --> 00:39:32.159
they would make sure i'd be too. I get to from schools, and

479
00:39:32.320 --> 00:39:37.119
then as I started like interacting with
like my cousins who lived on the reservation,

480
00:39:37.679 --> 00:39:40.440
they were like, you know,
Farmings is like racist And I was

481
00:39:40.519 --> 00:39:45.000
like what do you mean. They
were like, yeah, it's like racist,

482
00:39:45.039 --> 00:39:47.880
like a racist town. And I
was like okay, And like cut

483
00:39:47.920 --> 00:39:53.039
me to that realization of like,
wow, I'm in the space run limited

484
00:39:53.119 --> 00:39:59.599
and expressing who I am. And
there's a lot of ways that my parents

485
00:39:59.719 --> 00:40:05.280
were protecting me from all these different
areas. So in my basis, I

486
00:40:05.559 --> 00:40:10.000
talk with Native American UH director within
the high school that I went to,

487
00:40:12.480 --> 00:40:15.320
and like, reminder, this is
the same high school that had that same

488
00:40:15.880 --> 00:40:23.119
racial bi racialized violence that was going
on, and they've had like this different

489
00:40:23.280 --> 00:40:28.880
types of programming over the years.
But again, like if you really want

490
00:40:28.960 --> 00:40:35.480
to help these students take this knowledge
that you're ruining and put use it in

491
00:40:35.599 --> 00:40:40.000
those positions, those small positions that
are there. It was also another person

492
00:40:40.079 --> 00:40:46.760
that interviewed there are they those school
board they're like the school board president and

493
00:40:46.800 --> 00:40:54.519
they were like the first Native school
board president ever in Farmington, and that

494
00:40:54.800 --> 00:41:02.840
itself has shifted self perspective, so
they of an Indigenous folks, so activist

495
00:41:02.920 --> 00:41:08.800
wise, it's it's hard because you
need to have some sort of position for

496
00:41:08.920 --> 00:41:15.800
people to look at you or do
people to take you legitimately. But again,

497
00:41:15.639 --> 00:41:20.519
there's open meetings, there's school board
meetings. I know there's an Indian

498
00:41:20.639 --> 00:41:27.559
Youth Council within Farmington that youth can
join and participate in. My AUNT actually

499
00:41:28.199 --> 00:41:31.119
helps run some of the things there
for Native and Indigenous folks, Like if

500
00:41:31.159 --> 00:41:35.280
you're in close proximity to like your
home community, get involved in your chapter.

501
00:41:35.840 --> 00:41:37.920
See what's happening there. See what
type of financial aid they have,

502
00:41:38.119 --> 00:41:44.440
what type of work opportunities are there
for you, opportunities for you to cultivate

503
00:41:45.159 --> 00:41:50.000
career and college opportunities that are to
get towards youth. But then again that

504
00:41:50.079 --> 00:41:53.559
comes to the caveat of you having
access to go to and from. It's

505
00:41:53.639 --> 00:41:59.960
tricky, but I want to go
back home and create some type of impact.

506
00:42:00.559 --> 00:42:02.679
I don't necessarily what that looks like. I don't know what that looks

507
00:42:02.760 --> 00:42:07.719
like. Now. It's going to
be youth centered in youth blood, and

508
00:42:07.280 --> 00:42:10.960
that's my hope and I want to
keep it that hope. And my heart

509
00:42:12.039 --> 00:42:16.440
goes out to all Indigenous youths out
there for navigating. I mean, I'm

510
00:42:16.480 --> 00:42:21.559
still I'm still used. I have
so much to learn and throughout these next

511
00:42:21.639 --> 00:42:24.480
ten fifteen years to like, so
much so learn about. But that's what

512
00:42:24.599 --> 00:42:29.760
I hope to do in the future. Amazing. Thank you so much,

513
00:42:30.000 --> 00:42:34.559
Keana for the work that you're doing
in the community, for the community,

514
00:42:35.199 --> 00:42:40.480
and for your willingness and just the
desire and the curiosity that you have to

515
00:42:42.320 --> 00:42:49.599
undig some pretty important information for future
generations to learn from as well. Well.

516
00:42:49.679 --> 00:42:52.400
Last qession I did have so since
you know, the seventies when all

517
00:42:52.480 --> 00:43:00.760
that had happened, has Farmington changed
when it comes to being racist. I'm

518
00:43:00.840 --> 00:43:07.119
not familiar. I'm not yeah,
like that far up in the state or

519
00:43:07.239 --> 00:43:12.199
areas. But for those who are
not familiar, you don't know the history.

520
00:43:12.360 --> 00:43:15.119
And I'm just learning about it.
Do you what's it like now?

521
00:43:16.119 --> 00:43:22.719
In many ways, it's like the
overt racism that I feel many people experience.

522
00:43:23.119 --> 00:43:27.960
So it's not like all right,
Like a lot of like the slurs

523
00:43:28.519 --> 00:43:31.199
you don't like, you don't usually
hear those anymore. A lot of like

524
00:43:31.280 --> 00:43:37.199
the terms usually you don't hear anymore. But it's small things. My dad

525
00:43:37.400 --> 00:43:39.239
actually called me the other day,
or I called my dad the other day

526
00:43:39.559 --> 00:43:43.639
and he was like, oh,
a Facebook memory came up, came up

527
00:43:43.679 --> 00:43:46.519
today, and it was like five
ors, so six years ago. We

528
00:43:46.599 --> 00:43:51.920
were at ib It's restaurant. We
were at we're at some restaurants and I

529
00:43:52.039 --> 00:43:57.000
remember this older white ladies saying,
oh, go back to the reservation,

530
00:43:57.880 --> 00:44:01.119
and that was like oh. I
was like oh okay. But then like

531
00:44:01.199 --> 00:44:05.119
my Atlatic group, I was like, we don't live like, we don't

532
00:44:05.199 --> 00:44:07.440
live there, we don't live off
there. And my Dad's like, yeah,

533
00:44:07.719 --> 00:44:10.440
I remember you were so round enough
and you're ready to go at him

534
00:44:10.480 --> 00:44:16.960
and you're I was like yeah,
I was like sir. But she was

535
00:44:17.000 --> 00:44:22.039
like a mother of the student that
we went to school with, and like

536
00:44:22.159 --> 00:44:25.159
my brother knew the student. So
it's that Also you have like that generational

537
00:44:27.239 --> 00:44:32.280
that generational racism that's still ingrained in
the community and it's being taught in really

538
00:44:32.960 --> 00:44:40.920
new ways to harm the indigenous Indigenous
peoples. And now we're there is definitely

539
00:44:42.000 --> 00:44:45.760
like an influx of need to people
within Farmington. Now there's also like an

540
00:44:45.800 --> 00:44:52.039
increasing Pasific islander of population within the
area black population. But it's also looking

541
00:44:52.079 --> 00:44:58.559
at the systems too, like the
criminal justice system is horrible through Native and

542
00:44:58.679 --> 00:45:05.440
Indigenous folks and we're over criminalized highly
surveyance. Even within those systems that are

543
00:45:05.480 --> 00:45:08.800
still there, and I mentioned earlier
the healthcare system. Healthcare system again,

544
00:45:09.960 --> 00:45:16.480
you have all elders who go into
the nursing homes, who go into go

545
00:45:16.920 --> 00:45:21.440
checkups and you know, like I
said, there's no people that translate them,

546
00:45:21.880 --> 00:45:25.840
or you have healthcare providers that aren't
listening to these Native and Indigenous folks.

547
00:45:25.880 --> 00:45:30.119
So yeah, that's not right in
your face. But those structures in

548
00:45:30.239 --> 00:45:34.000
place, they're all still there.
Yeah, that's intense. You know,

549
00:45:34.119 --> 00:45:37.679
it first starts with just learning about
it and addressing some of these well a

550
00:45:37.760 --> 00:45:42.840
lot of the issues to create the
change that needs to be made. And

551
00:45:42.960 --> 00:45:49.239
you're right, yeah, the generational
attitudes racism personalities that you know, like

552
00:45:49.360 --> 00:45:52.840
you mentioned, it was an older, older white woman that made that.

553
00:45:52.440 --> 00:45:57.000
But thank you so much for sharing
that. I appreciate that, Napoleon.

554
00:45:57.039 --> 00:46:00.719
Did you want to have any last
questions are the thank you so much for

555
00:46:00.840 --> 00:46:06.920
being here with us and giving the
listeners some really worldview, just some you

556
00:46:06.960 --> 00:46:09.280
know, your perspective, and as
always, you know, keep up the

557
00:46:09.320 --> 00:46:14.280
good work that you're doing. And
thank you so much for sharing with us

558
00:46:14.400 --> 00:46:19.559
and then giving us a lessons like
your students, and so you've made two

559
00:46:19.599 --> 00:46:22.360
more students. So yeah, but
that's it. Thank you so much.

560
00:46:23.079 --> 00:46:28.800
Well, thank you as for having
me, because something that's really important to

561
00:46:28.920 --> 00:46:32.000
me, like a subject I want
to continue learning about and expand upon.

562
00:46:32.360 --> 00:46:38.920
And I think all of the previous
indigenous organizers and scholars who have grounded this

563
00:46:39.079 --> 00:46:46.239
work and are setting foundations to build
upon it and create interconnections of solidarity.

564
00:46:46.400 --> 00:46:53.440
Particularly I look at Jennifer Dnadel,
who's raised generations of Indigenous scholars and activists,

565
00:46:54.280 --> 00:47:00.880
reproducing a lot of revolutionaries who are
actually on the ground work, and

566
00:47:01.679 --> 00:47:07.360
I'm just a very shaky, it's
very slunky helping you in that already movement

567
00:47:07.440 --> 00:47:15.480
that's there has been ongoing amazing well, for any other listeners tuning in out

568
00:47:15.519 --> 00:47:19.440
there, feel free to check out
the description. There are going to be

569
00:47:19.519 --> 00:47:23.719
some helpful links there for you,
the YouTube that we talked about and any

570
00:47:23.880 --> 00:47:30.159
online articles about specifically talking about border
towns. You can find that all in

571
00:47:30.239 --> 00:47:34.480
the description, And if you want
to learn more about the podcast, check

572
00:47:34.519 --> 00:47:39.159
out our website to Young Voices dot
com and again check out Keana Pete on

573
00:47:39.239 --> 00:47:45.320
her socials where she shares a lot
of really informative content for you out there.

574
00:47:45.559 --> 00:47:50.639
So thank you all so much for
listening to on the Young Voices podcast

575
00:47:50.719 --> 00:48:01.000
featuring myself Tina and co hosted by
nap Bullion. Thank you listeners for tuning

576
00:48:01.119 --> 00:48:08.079
into today's episode on the Young Voices. Be sure to check out our website

577
00:48:08.239 --> 00:48:15.920
at Toyong Voices dot com to learn
more about the work we do both on

578
00:48:15.360 --> 00:48:16.400
and off the mic.